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	<title>Comments on: Nuns and the Death Penalty at the Ath</title>
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	<link>http://cmcforum.com/news/11132009-nuns-and-the-death-penalty-at-the-ath</link>
	<description>The Official Student Publication of Claremont McKenna College</description>
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		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://cmcforum.com/news/11132009-nuns-and-the-death-penalty-at-the-ath#comment-18071</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Nov 2009 11:31:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cmcforum.com/?p=8312#comment-18071</guid>
		<description>Also, &quot;A Catholic&quot; (a controversial handle, no?), why then are recidivism rates higher in states with the death penalty?  I suggest you consult Clarence Darrow&#039;s argument against the death penalty.

To be frank, most pro-death penalty &quot;Catholics&quot; use such twisted argument to justify swallowing the Republican agenda hook, line, and sinker.  

Let he who has not sinned throw the first stone.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Also, &#8220;A Catholic&#8221; (a controversial handle, no?), why then are recidivism rates higher in states with the death penalty?  I suggest you consult Clarence Darrow&#8217;s argument against the death penalty.</p>
<p>To be frank, most pro-death penalty &#8220;Catholics&#8221; use such twisted argument to justify swallowing the Republican agenda hook, line, and sinker.  </p>
<p>Let he who has not sinned throw the first stone.</p>
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		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://cmcforum.com/news/11132009-nuns-and-the-death-penalty-at-the-ath#comment-49444</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Nov 2009 11:31:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cmcforum.com/?p=8312#comment-49444</guid>
		<description>Also, &quot;A Catholic&quot; (a controversial handle, no?), why then are recidivism rates higher in states with the death penalty?  I suggest you consult Clarence Darrow&#039;s argument against the death penalty.

To be frank, most pro-death penalty &quot;Catholics&quot; use such twisted argument to justify swallowing the Republican agenda hook, line, and sinker.  

Let he who has not sinned throw the first stone.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Also, &#8220;A Catholic&#8221; (a controversial handle, no?), why then are recidivism rates higher in states with the death penalty?  I suggest you consult Clarence Darrow&#8217;s argument against the death penalty.</p>
<p>To be frank, most pro-death penalty &#8220;Catholics&#8221; use such twisted argument to justify swallowing the Republican agenda hook, line, and sinker.  </p>
<p>Let he who has not sinned throw the first stone.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://cmcforum.com/news/11132009-nuns-and-the-death-penalty-at-the-ath#comment-18058</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Nov 2009 05:35:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cmcforum.com/?p=8312#comment-18058</guid>
		<description>The U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops has quite unequivocally stated that the death penalty is unjust in America today.  Any Catholic who disagrees with that is a cafeteria Catholic.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops has quite unequivocally stated that the death penalty is unjust in America today.  Any Catholic who disagrees with that is a cafeteria Catholic.</p>
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		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://cmcforum.com/news/11132009-nuns-and-the-death-penalty-at-the-ath#comment-49443</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Nov 2009 05:35:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cmcforum.com/?p=8312#comment-49443</guid>
		<description>The U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops has quite unequivocally stated that the death penalty is unjust in America today.  Any Catholic who disagrees with that is a cafeteria Catholic.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops has quite unequivocally stated that the death penalty is unjust in America today.  Any Catholic who disagrees with that is a cafeteria Catholic.</p>
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		<title>By: A Catholic</title>
		<link>http://cmcforum.com/news/11132009-nuns-and-the-death-penalty-at-the-ath#comment-17952</link>
		<dc:creator>A Catholic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Nov 2009 09:38:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cmcforum.com/?p=8312#comment-17952</guid>
		<description>Right, but the key, which the Pope and others have acknowledged is the use of that phrase &quot;practicable way to defend the lives of human beings &lt;b&gt;effectively&lt;/b&gt; against the aggressor.&quot; 

With the recidivism rates we see of violent offenders in prison, it&#039;s no surpise that many Catholics continue to support the death penalty and are justified in religious teachings.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Right, but the key, which the Pope and others have acknowledged is the use of that phrase &#8220;practicable way to defend the lives of human beings <b>effectively</b> against the aggressor.&#8221; </p>
<p>With the recidivism rates we see of violent offenders in prison, it&#8217;s no surpise that many Catholics continue to support the death penalty and are justified in religious teachings.</p>
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		<title>By: A Catholic</title>
		<link>http://cmcforum.com/news/11132009-nuns-and-the-death-penalty-at-the-ath#comment-49442</link>
		<dc:creator>A Catholic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Nov 2009 09:38:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cmcforum.com/?p=8312#comment-49442</guid>
		<description>Right, but the key, which the Pope and others have acknowledged is the use of that phrase &quot;practicable way to defend the lives of human beings &lt;b&gt;effectively&lt;/b&gt; against the aggressor.&quot; 

With the recidivism rates we see of violent offenders in prison, it&#039;s no surpise that many Catholics continue to support the death penalty and are justified in religious teachings.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Right, but the key, which the Pope and others have acknowledged is the use of that phrase &#8220;practicable way to defend the lives of human beings <b>effectively</b> against the aggressor.&#8221; </p>
<p>With the recidivism rates we see of violent offenders in prison, it&#8217;s no surpise that many Catholics continue to support the death penalty and are justified in religious teachings.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter - Another Catholic</title>
		<link>http://cmcforum.com/news/11132009-nuns-and-the-death-penalty-at-the-ath#comment-17949</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter - Another Catholic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Nov 2009 07:15:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cmcforum.com/?p=8312#comment-17949</guid>
		<description>Although a situation where  a Catholic could support the death penalty and stay true to Church teaching is philosophically conceivable, it is near impossible in modern states with police, justice, and prison systems such as ours:

From the Catechism: 

&quot;Capital Punishment

2266 The State&#039;s effort to contain the spread of behaviors injurious to human rights and the fundamental rules of civil coexistence corresponds to the requirement of watching over the common good. Legitimate public authority has the right and duty to inflict penalties commensurate with the gravity of the crime. the primary scope of the penalty is to redress the disorder caused by the offense. When his punishment is voluntarily accepted by the offender, it takes on the value of expiation. Moreover, punishment, in addition to preserving public order and the safety of persons, has a medicinal scope: as far as possible it should contribute to the correction of the offender.67

2267 The traditional teaching of the Church does not exclude, presupposing full ascertainment of the identity and responsibility of the offender, recourse to the death penalty, when this is the only practicable way to defend the lives of human beings effectively against the aggressor.
&quot;If, instead, bloodless means are sufficient to defend against the aggressor and to protect the safety of persons, public authority should limit itself to such means, because they better correspond to the concrete conditions of the common good and are more in conformity to the dignity of the human person.
&quot;Today, in fact, given the means at the State&#039;s disposal to effectively repress crime by rendering inoffensive the one who has committed it, without depriving him definitively of the possibility of redeeming himself, cases of absolute necessity for suppression of the offender &#039;today ... are very rare, if not practically non-existent.&#039;[John Paul II, Evangelium vitae 56.]&quot;

(copy/pasted from http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P7Z.HTM)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Although a situation where  a Catholic could support the death penalty and stay true to Church teaching is philosophically conceivable, it is near impossible in modern states with police, justice, and prison systems such as ours:</p>
<p>From the Catechism: </p>
<p>&#8220;Capital Punishment</p>
<p>2266 The State&#8217;s effort to contain the spread of behaviors injurious to human rights and the fundamental rules of civil coexistence corresponds to the requirement of watching over the common good. Legitimate public authority has the right and duty to inflict penalties commensurate with the gravity of the crime. the primary scope of the penalty is to redress the disorder caused by the offense. When his punishment is voluntarily accepted by the offender, it takes on the value of expiation. Moreover, punishment, in addition to preserving public order and the safety of persons, has a medicinal scope: as far as possible it should contribute to the correction of the offender.67</p>
<p>2267 The traditional teaching of the Church does not exclude, presupposing full ascertainment of the identity and responsibility of the offender, recourse to the death penalty, when this is the only practicable way to defend the lives of human beings effectively against the aggressor.<br />
&#8220;If, instead, bloodless means are sufficient to defend against the aggressor and to protect the safety of persons, public authority should limit itself to such means, because they better correspond to the concrete conditions of the common good and are more in conformity to the dignity of the human person.<br />
&#8220;Today, in fact, given the means at the State&#8217;s disposal to effectively repress crime by rendering inoffensive the one who has committed it, without depriving him definitively of the possibility of redeeming himself, cases of absolute necessity for suppression of the offender &#8216;today &#8230; are very rare, if not practically non-existent.&#8217;[John Paul II, Evangelium vitae 56.]&#8221;</p>
<p>(copy/pasted from <a href="http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P7Z.HTM" rel="nofollow">http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P7Z.HTM</a>)</p>
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		<title>By: Peter - Another Catholic</title>
		<link>http://cmcforum.com/news/11132009-nuns-and-the-death-penalty-at-the-ath#comment-49441</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter - Another Catholic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Nov 2009 07:15:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cmcforum.com/?p=8312#comment-49441</guid>
		<description>Although a situation where  a Catholic could support the death penalty and stay true to Church teaching is philosophically conceivable, it is near impossible in modern states with police, justice, and prison systems such as ours:

From the Catechism: 

&quot;Capital Punishment

2266 The State&#039;s effort to contain the spread of behaviors injurious to human rights and the fundamental rules of civil coexistence corresponds to the requirement of watching over the common good. Legitimate public authority has the right and duty to inflict penalties commensurate with the gravity of the crime. the primary scope of the penalty is to redress the disorder caused by the offense. When his punishment is voluntarily accepted by the offender, it takes on the value of expiation. Moreover, punishment, in addition to preserving public order and the safety of persons, has a medicinal scope: as far as possible it should contribute to the correction of the offender.67

2267 The traditional teaching of the Church does not exclude, presupposing full ascertainment of the identity and responsibility of the offender, recourse to the death penalty, when this is the only practicable way to defend the lives of human beings effectively against the aggressor.
&quot;If, instead, bloodless means are sufficient to defend against the aggressor and to protect the safety of persons, public authority should limit itself to such means, because they better correspond to the concrete conditions of the common good and are more in conformity to the dignity of the human person.
&quot;Today, in fact, given the means at the State&#039;s disposal to effectively repress crime by rendering inoffensive the one who has committed it, without depriving him definitively of the possibility of redeeming himself, cases of absolute necessity for suppression of the offender &#039;today ... are very rare, if not practically non-existent.&#039;[John Paul II, Evangelium vitae 56.]&quot;

(copy/pasted from http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P7Z.HTM)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Although a situation where  a Catholic could support the death penalty and stay true to Church teaching is philosophically conceivable, it is near impossible in modern states with police, justice, and prison systems such as ours:</p>
<p>From the Catechism: </p>
<p>&#8220;Capital Punishment</p>
<p>2266 The State&#8217;s effort to contain the spread of behaviors injurious to human rights and the fundamental rules of civil coexistence corresponds to the requirement of watching over the common good. Legitimate public authority has the right and duty to inflict penalties commensurate with the gravity of the crime. the primary scope of the penalty is to redress the disorder caused by the offense. When his punishment is voluntarily accepted by the offender, it takes on the value of expiation. Moreover, punishment, in addition to preserving public order and the safety of persons, has a medicinal scope: as far as possible it should contribute to the correction of the offender.67</p>
<p>2267 The traditional teaching of the Church does not exclude, presupposing full ascertainment of the identity and responsibility of the offender, recourse to the death penalty, when this is the only practicable way to defend the lives of human beings effectively against the aggressor.<br />
&#8220;If, instead, bloodless means are sufficient to defend against the aggressor and to protect the safety of persons, public authority should limit itself to such means, because they better correspond to the concrete conditions of the common good and are more in conformity to the dignity of the human person.<br />
&#8220;Today, in fact, given the means at the State&#8217;s disposal to effectively repress crime by rendering inoffensive the one who has committed it, without depriving him definitively of the possibility of redeeming himself, cases of absolute necessity for suppression of the offender &#8216;today &#8230; are very rare, if not practically non-existent.&#8217;[John Paul II, Evangelium vitae 56.]&#8221;</p>
<p>(copy/pasted from <a href="http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P7Z.HTM" rel="nofollow">http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P7Z.HTM</a>)</p>
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		<title>By: A Catholic</title>
		<link>http://cmcforum.com/news/11132009-nuns-and-the-death-penalty-at-the-ath#comment-17943</link>
		<dc:creator>A Catholic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Nov 2009 03:41:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cmcforum.com/?p=8312#comment-17943</guid>
		<description>It is by no means clear that Catholicism is opposed to the death penalty. As the Catechism of Trent puts it, 

&quot;Another kind of lawful slaying belongs to the civil authorities, to whom is entrusted power of life and death, by the legal and judicious exercise of which they punish the guilty and protect the innocent. The just use of this power, far from involving the crime of murder, is an act of paramount obedience to this Commandment which prohibits murder. The end of the Commandment is the preservation and security of human life. Now the punishments inflicted by the civil authority, which is the legitimate avenger of crime, naturally tend to this end, since they give security to life by repressing outrage and violence. Hence these words of David: In the morning I put to death all the wicked of the land, that I might cut off all the workers of iniquity from the city of the Lord.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is by no means clear that Catholicism is opposed to the death penalty. As the Catechism of Trent puts it, </p>
<p>&#8220;Another kind of lawful slaying belongs to the civil authorities, to whom is entrusted power of life and death, by the legal and judicious exercise of which they punish the guilty and protect the innocent. The just use of this power, far from involving the crime of murder, is an act of paramount obedience to this Commandment which prohibits murder. The end of the Commandment is the preservation and security of human life. Now the punishments inflicted by the civil authority, which is the legitimate avenger of crime, naturally tend to this end, since they give security to life by repressing outrage and violence. Hence these words of David: In the morning I put to death all the wicked of the land, that I might cut off all the workers of iniquity from the city of the Lord.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: A Catholic</title>
		<link>http://cmcforum.com/news/11132009-nuns-and-the-death-penalty-at-the-ath#comment-49440</link>
		<dc:creator>A Catholic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Nov 2009 03:41:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cmcforum.com/?p=8312#comment-49440</guid>
		<description>It is by no means clear that Catholicism is opposed to the death penalty. As the Catechism of Trent puts it, 

&quot;Another kind of lawful slaying belongs to the civil authorities, to whom is entrusted power of life and death, by the legal and judicious exercise of which they punish the guilty and protect the innocent. The just use of this power, far from involving the crime of murder, is an act of paramount obedience to this Commandment which prohibits murder. The end of the Commandment is the preservation and security of human life. Now the punishments inflicted by the civil authority, which is the legitimate avenger of crime, naturally tend to this end, since they give security to life by repressing outrage and violence. Hence these words of David: In the morning I put to death all the wicked of the land, that I might cut off all the workers of iniquity from the city of the Lord.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is by no means clear that Catholicism is opposed to the death penalty. As the Catechism of Trent puts it, </p>
<p>&#8220;Another kind of lawful slaying belongs to the civil authorities, to whom is entrusted power of life and death, by the legal and judicious exercise of which they punish the guilty and protect the innocent. The just use of this power, far from involving the crime of murder, is an act of paramount obedience to this Commandment which prohibits murder. The end of the Commandment is the preservation and security of human life. Now the punishments inflicted by the civil authority, which is the legitimate avenger of crime, naturally tend to this end, since they give security to life by repressing outrage and violence. Hence these words of David: In the morning I put to death all the wicked of the land, that I might cut off all the workers of iniquity from the city of the Lord.&#8221;</p>
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