Comments on: Ethical Questions Surround Collins Firing http://cmcforum.com/news/04132009-ethical-questions-surround-collins-firing The Official Student Publication of Claremont McKenna College Wed, 08 Feb 2012 07:14:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Victoria Din http://cmcforum.com/news/04132009-ethical-questions-surround-collins-firing#comment-6735 Victoria Din Tue, 14 Apr 2009 04:52:55 +0000 http://cmcforum.com/?p=3448#comment-6735 To Apathy: Michael's article and my response both acknowledge the fact that CMC was within its rights when it decided to fire Pedro. You're also correct to point out that there are gaps in our knowledge (as Michael outlines, the administration refused to comment) and that the current economic state undoubtedly plays a role in any administrative decision. (For more on this, check out the Forum's post on President Gann's early retirement plan: http://cmcforum.com/news/03232009-news-brief-15-acceptance-rate-early-retirement.) I disagree with your argument that student apathy should somehow act as a deterrent in trying to raise awareness of the present conditions facing Collins staff. What information we do posses points to several serious issues that Michael and I have both already highlighted and that you also mentioned. First, the clinical, removed manner in which Pedro's family situation was handled is startling and unacceptable in such a small community. Secondly, the convoluted, inaccessible policies and bureaucracy of HR need to be reconsidered. You're right. Its wrong that Pedro's case has gone unexamined since January. The Worker's Support Committee met with administration on two occasions, to no avail. By going public and raising awareness, we hope to combat the very apathy you mentioned. To Apathy:

Michael’s article and my response both acknowledge the fact that CMC was within its rights when it decided to fire Pedro. You’re also correct to point out that there are gaps in our knowledge (as Michael outlines, the administration refused to comment) and that the current economic state undoubtedly plays a role in any administrative decision. (For more on this, check out the Forum’s post on President Gann’s early retirement plan: http://cmcforum.com/news/03232009-news-brief-15-acceptance-rate-early-retirement.)

I disagree with your argument that student apathy should somehow act as a deterrent in trying to raise awareness of the present conditions facing Collins staff. What information we do posses points to several serious issues that Michael and I have both already highlighted and that you also mentioned. First, the clinical, removed manner in which Pedro’s family situation was handled is startling and unacceptable in such a small community. Secondly, the convoluted, inaccessible policies and bureaucracy of HR need to be reconsidered.

You’re right. Its wrong that Pedro’s case has gone unexamined since January. The Worker’s Support Committee met with administration on two occasions, to no avail. By going public and raising awareness, we hope to combat the very apathy you mentioned.

]]> By: Victoria Din http://cmcforum.com/news/04132009-ethical-questions-surround-collins-firing#comment-47369 Victoria Din Tue, 14 Apr 2009 04:52:00 +0000 http://cmcforum.com/?p=3448#comment-47369 To Apathy: Michael's article and my response both acknowledge the fact that CMC was within its rights when it decided to fire Pedro. You're also correct to point out that there are gaps in our knowledge (as Michael outlines, the administration refused to comment) and that the current economic state undoubtedly plays a role in any administrative decision. (For more on this, check out the Forum's post on President Gann's early retirement plan: http://cmcforum.com/news/03232009-news-brief-15-acceptance-rate-early-retirement.) I disagree with your argument that student apathy should somehow act as a deterrent in trying to raise awareness of the present conditions facing Collins staff. What information we do posses points to several serious issues that Michael and I have both already highlighted and that you also mentioned. First, the clinical, removed manner in which Pedro's family situation was handled is startling and unacceptable in such a small community. Secondly, the convoluted, inaccessible policies and bureaucracy of HR need to be reconsidered. You're right. Its wrong that Pedro's case has gone unexamined since January. The Worker's Support Committee met with administration on two occasions, to no avail. By going public and raising awareness, we hope to combat the very apathy you mentioned. To Apathy:

Michael’s article and my response both acknowledge the fact that CMC was within its rights when it decided to fire Pedro. You’re also correct to point out that there are gaps in our knowledge (as Michael outlines, the administration refused to comment) and that the current economic state undoubtedly plays a role in any administrative decision. (For more on this, check out the Forum’s post on President Gann’s early retirement plan: http://cmcforum.com/news/03232009-news-brief-15-acceptance-rate-early-retirement.)

I disagree with your argument that student apathy should somehow act as a deterrent in trying to raise awareness of the present conditions facing Collins staff. What information we do posses points to several serious issues that Michael and I have both already highlighted and that you also mentioned. First, the clinical, removed manner in which Pedro’s family situation was handled is startling and unacceptable in such a small community. Secondly, the convoluted, inaccessible policies and bureaucracy of HR need to be reconsidered.

You’re right. Its wrong that Pedro’s case has gone unexamined since January. The Worker’s Support Committee met with administration on two occasions, to no avail. By going public and raising awareness, we hope to combat the very apathy you mentioned.

]]> By: Apathy http://cmcforum.com/news/04132009-ethical-questions-surround-collins-firing#comment-6729 Apathy Tue, 14 Apr 2009 03:06:49 +0000 http://cmcforum.com/?p=3448#comment-6729 Student anger? This story is two and a half months old and only a select few have openly cared about it (and I applaud those who have). Regardless, we still don't know all the facts. CMC reportedly contacted Pedro by phone (in spanish) while he was in Mexico and Pedro reportedly did not respond. While CMC's bureaucratic and unnecessary paperwork policy should not get an employee fired, if the employee purposefully ignored this phone call and did not even respond, then that is grounds for firing. There are other facts we don't know, such as this worker's past history, whether CMC was trying to get people fired to cut the budget, and whether Pedro had any benefits whiwch were taken away since Pedro was fired due to his own action's (as opposed to firing pedro for reasons not associated with him). We need the facts and presenting this story from one side only does harm for Pedro. The real story is likely that Pedro was fired as Collins is cutting the budget. If you talk to any of the employees there, you'll notice that shifts have been changed and shortened and that hours have been cut across the board. If this is the reason for the firing, then I'm all for a mass protest, but until we know the facts, and if we keep framing this as a language issue (as opposed to an unfair firing associated with budget cuts issue), then I predict student apathy will continue. Student anger? This story is two and a half months old and only a select few have openly cared about it (and I applaud those who have). Regardless, we still don’t know all the facts. CMC reportedly contacted Pedro by phone (in spanish) while he was in Mexico and Pedro reportedly did not respond. While CMC’s bureaucratic and unnecessary paperwork policy should not get an employee fired, if the employee purposefully ignored this phone call and did not even respond, then that is grounds for firing. There are other facts we don’t know, such as this worker’s past history, whether CMC was trying to get people fired to cut the budget, and whether Pedro had any benefits whiwch were taken away since Pedro was fired due to his own action’s (as opposed to firing pedro for reasons not associated with him). We need the facts and presenting this story from one side only does harm for Pedro.

The real story is likely that Pedro was fired as Collins is cutting the budget. If you talk to any of the employees there, you’ll notice that shifts have been changed and shortened and that hours have been cut across the board. If this is the reason for the firing, then I’m all for a mass protest, but until we know the facts, and if we keep framing this as a language issue (as opposed to an unfair firing associated with budget cuts issue), then I predict student apathy will continue.

]]> By: Apathy http://cmcforum.com/news/04132009-ethical-questions-surround-collins-firing#comment-47368 Apathy Tue, 14 Apr 2009 03:06:00 +0000 http://cmcforum.com/?p=3448#comment-47368 Student anger? This story is two and a half months old and only a select few have openly cared about it (and I applaud those who have). Regardless, we still don't know all the facts. CMC reportedly contacted Pedro by phone (in spanish) while he was in Mexico and Pedro reportedly did not respond. While CMC's bureaucratic and unnecessary paperwork policy should not get an employee fired, if the employee purposefully ignored this phone call and did not even respond, then that is grounds for firing. There are other facts we don't know, such as this worker's past history, whether CMC was trying to get people fired to cut the budget, and whether Pedro had any benefits whiwch were taken away since Pedro was fired due to his own action's (as opposed to firing pedro for reasons not associated with him). We need the facts and presenting this story from one side only does harm for Pedro. The real story is likely that Pedro was fired as Collins is cutting the budget. If you talk to any of the employees there, you'll notice that shifts have been changed and shortened and that hours have been cut across the board. If this is the reason for the firing, then I'm all for a mass protest, but until we know the facts, and if we keep framing this as a language issue (as opposed to an unfair firing associated with budget cuts issue), then I predict student apathy will continue. Student anger? This story is two and a half months old and only a select few have openly cared about it (and I applaud those who have). Regardless, we still don’t know all the facts. CMC reportedly contacted Pedro by phone (in spanish) while he was in Mexico and Pedro reportedly did not respond. While CMC’s bureaucratic and unnecessary paperwork policy should not get an employee fired, if the employee purposefully ignored this phone call and did not even respond, then that is grounds for firing. There are other facts we don’t know, such as this worker’s past history, whether CMC was trying to get people fired to cut the budget, and whether Pedro had any benefits whiwch were taken away since Pedro was fired due to his own action’s (as opposed to firing pedro for reasons not associated with him). We need the facts and presenting this story from one side only does harm for Pedro.

The real story is likely that Pedro was fired as Collins is cutting the budget. If you talk to any of the employees there, you’ll notice that shifts have been changed and shortened and that hours have been cut across the board. If this is the reason for the firing, then I’m all for a mass protest, but until we know the facts, and if we keep framing this as a language issue (as opposed to an unfair firing associated with budget cuts issue), then I predict student apathy will continue.

]]> By: Victoria Din http://cmcforum.com/news/04132009-ethical-questions-surround-collins-firing#comment-6720 Victoria Din Tue, 14 Apr 2009 01:09:53 +0000 http://cmcforum.com/?p=3448#comment-6720 I would like to echo some of the sentiments from Michael's article. The circumstances surrounding Pedro's termination are difficult. And yes, HR was within its rights in its decision to fire him. However, there is also an expectation that all staff members at Claremont McKenna be treated with respect. Upholding his termination would be a drastic measure to take in a case where miscommunication has clearly occurred. After nearly a decade of service, the decision to fire Pedro illustrates a lack of sensitivity and understanding that is unacceptable in a small school such as Claremont McKenna. Furthermore, the resources available to the Spanish-speaking staff are inadequate, both in content and form. If the administration makes the decision to hire a predominantly Spanish-speaking staff, the resources should reflect that decision. Speaking loudly and slowly to an employee who is under duress is not an adequate solution. The inaccessibility of information regarding emergency leave rules and other regulations make CMC's unrelenting enforcement unfair and unreasonable. Pedro is a valued member of the Claremont McKenna community. The Democrats of the Claremont Colleges and other interested students are starting a <a href="http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/defend-the-rights-of-workers---defend-pedro-gonzalez" rel="nofollow">petition</a> (http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/defend-the-rights-of-workers---defend-pedro-gonzalez) to address these concerns. If you're interested in helping, we'll be meeting Wednesday, April 15 at 8:00 in Beckett Lounge. I would like to echo some of the sentiments from Michael’s article. The circumstances surrounding Pedro’s termination are difficult. And yes, HR was within its rights in its decision to fire him. However, there is also an expectation that all staff members at Claremont McKenna be treated with respect. Upholding his termination would be a drastic measure to take in a case where miscommunication has clearly occurred.

After nearly a decade of service, the decision to fire Pedro illustrates a lack of sensitivity and understanding that is unacceptable in a small school such as Claremont McKenna. Furthermore, the resources available to the Spanish-speaking staff are inadequate, both in content and form. If the administration makes the decision to hire a predominantly Spanish-speaking staff, the resources should reflect that decision. Speaking loudly and slowly to an employee who is under duress is not an adequate solution. The inaccessibility of information regarding emergency leave rules and other regulations make CMC’s unrelenting enforcement unfair and unreasonable.

Pedro is a valued member of the Claremont McKenna community. The Democrats of the Claremont Colleges and other interested students are starting a petition (http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/defend-the-rights-of-workers—defend-pedro-gonzalez) to address these concerns. If you’re interested in helping, we’ll be meeting Wednesday, April 15 at 8:00 in Beckett Lounge.

]]> By: Victoria Din http://cmcforum.com/news/04132009-ethical-questions-surround-collins-firing#comment-47367 Victoria Din Tue, 14 Apr 2009 01:09:00 +0000 http://cmcforum.com/?p=3448#comment-47367 I would like to echo some of the sentiments from Michael's article. The circumstances surrounding Pedro's termination are difficult. And yes, HR was within its rights in its decision to fire him. However, there is also an expectation that all staff members at Claremont McKenna be treated with respect. Upholding his termination would be a drastic measure to take in a case where miscommunication has clearly occurred. After nearly a decade of service, the decision to fire Pedro illustrates a lack of sensitivity and understanding that is unacceptable in a small school such as Claremont McKenna. Furthermore, the resources available to the Spanish-speaking staff are inadequate, both in content and form. If the administration makes the decision to hire a predominantly Spanish-speaking staff, the resources should reflect that decision. Speaking loudly and slowly to an employee who is under duress is not an adequate solution. The inaccessibility of information regarding emergency leave rules and other regulations make CMC's unrelenting enforcement unfair and unreasonable. Pedro is a valued member of the Claremont McKenna community. The Democrats of the Claremont Colleges and other interested students are starting a <a href="http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/defend-the-rights-of-workers---defend-pedro-gonzalez" rel="nofollow">petition</a> (http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/defend-the-rights-of-workers---defend-pedro-gonzalez) to address these concerns. If you're interested in helping, we'll be meeting Wednesday, April 15 at 8:00 in Beckett Lounge. I would like to echo some of the sentiments from Michael’s article. The circumstances surrounding Pedro’s termination are difficult. And yes, HR was within its rights in its decision to fire him. However, there is also an expectation that all staff members at Claremont McKenna be treated with respect. Upholding his termination would be a drastic measure to take in a case where miscommunication has clearly occurred.

After nearly a decade of service, the decision to fire Pedro illustrates a lack of sensitivity and understanding that is unacceptable in a small school such as Claremont McKenna. Furthermore, the resources available to the Spanish-speaking staff are inadequate, both in content and form. If the administration makes the decision to hire a predominantly Spanish-speaking staff, the resources should reflect that decision. Speaking loudly and slowly to an employee who is under duress is not an adequate solution. The inaccessibility of information regarding emergency leave rules and other regulations make CMC’s unrelenting enforcement unfair and unreasonable.

Pedro is a valued member of the Claremont McKenna community. The Democrats of the Claremont Colleges and other interested students are starting a petition (http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/defend-the-rights-of-workers—defend-pedro-gonzalez) to address these concerns. If you’re interested in helping, we’ll be meeting Wednesday, April 15 at 8:00 in Beckett Lounge.

]]> By: Common Sense http://cmcforum.com/news/04132009-ethical-questions-surround-collins-firing#comment-6719 Common Sense Tue, 14 Apr 2009 00:52:56 +0000 http://cmcforum.com/?p=3448#comment-6719 The courtesy issue is a real issue, but if Pedro didn't communicate his situation to HR, what can they do about it? But the language issue is totally silly. Sorry, if you work for an employer, it's your job to figure out what the rules are. Especially if you live in a country where most people speak a specific language that you don't. The reality is that Hispanic workers should be strongly encouraged to learn English and learn the rules. A society doesn't thive when it's split down the middle. And no, this is not an issue of racism or discrimination. People are getting angry because that's what these types do: they find issues to go nuts over. Grow up. And in the mean time, hopefully Pedro will get a fair hearing. The courtesy issue is a real issue, but if Pedro didn’t communicate his situation to HR, what can they do about it?

But the language issue is totally silly. Sorry, if you work for an employer, it’s your job to figure out what the rules are. Especially if you live in a country where most people speak a specific language that you don’t.

The reality is that Hispanic workers should be strongly encouraged to learn English and learn the rules. A society doesn’t thive when it’s split down the middle.

And no, this is not an issue of racism or discrimination. People are getting angry because that’s what these types do: they find issues to go nuts over. Grow up. And in the mean time, hopefully Pedro will get a fair hearing.

]]> By: Common Sense http://cmcforum.com/news/04132009-ethical-questions-surround-collins-firing#comment-47366 Common Sense Tue, 14 Apr 2009 00:52:00 +0000 http://cmcforum.com/?p=3448#comment-47366 The courtesy issue is a real issue, but if Pedro didn't communicate his situation to HR, what can they do about it? But the language issue is totally silly. Sorry, if you work for an employer, it's your job to figure out what the rules are. Especially if you live in a country where most people speak a specific language that you don't. The reality is that Hispanic workers should be strongly encouraged to learn English and learn the rules. A society doesn't thive when it's split down the middle. And no, this is not an issue of racism or discrimination. People are getting angry because that's what these types do: they find issues to go nuts over. Grow up. And in the mean time, hopefully Pedro will get a fair hearing. The courtesy issue is a real issue, but if Pedro didn’t communicate his situation to HR, what can they do about it?

But the language issue is totally silly. Sorry, if you work for an employer, it’s your job to figure out what the rules are. Especially if you live in a country where most people speak a specific language that you don’t.

The reality is that Hispanic workers should be strongly encouraged to learn English and learn the rules. A society doesn’t thive when it’s split down the middle.

And no, this is not an issue of racism or discrimination. People are getting angry because that’s what these types do: they find issues to go nuts over. Grow up. And in the mean time, hopefully Pedro will get a fair hearing.

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